Discussion:
HELP! 2001 Impala Headlights
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Burn Baby Burn
2003-07-25 20:35:05 UTC
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Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?

Thanks in advance,
BB
Roy G. Bragg
2003-07-26 05:10:55 UTC
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I don't know about base model Impalas, but my 2000 LS has the capability to
turn off the auto headlight feature through the radio panel. Personally, I
don't see the problem. If the headlights MUST be off with the engine
running, turn on the park lights manually, that should turn the headlights
off.
Roy
You're not doing anything wrong. Maddening as hell isn't it!? But you
won't get one bit of sympathy from the GM Lemmings that hang out in this
news group. They think the lighting idiocy GM forces on it's paying
customer is just as wonderful as apple pie (even if it is certainly NOT as
"American" as apple pie!)! They'll say that you're some kind of nut case
for wanting to turn you lights out when it's dark (even though there are
clearly some situations when you may want to...you example being one of
many). They don't think you have any right to have control over the
lighting systems (even though every state law I know of is very clear in
stating that it's the operator's responsibility...not the manufacturers,
or
anyone else's). I've been down this road on this topic with GM...all the
way up to letters to Bob Lutz. A few other people I know have also. They
don't even write back...just a black hole. The dealer won't disable the
auto systems either! So, good luck. Next time buy a Ford or a Chrysler
product...they are normal cars that function like normal cars... Imagine
that!? Now, here come the flames!!!
| Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
| was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
| leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
| During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
| DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
| the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
| parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
| on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?
|
| Thanks in advance,
| BB
James C. Reeves
2003-07-26 15:25:03 UTC
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I wish my Malibu LS had that disable feature. I've explained why before, so
I will spare the regulars of this NG that rant again. ;-)

I don't think your suggestion will help this person though. Even if he does
as you suggest (turn the switch to the "parking light" position), drive in
theaters I've known require ALL lights be extinguished which can't be done
on many of the GMs in the situation that the original post describes. And,
if he was able to disable the auto light control through the radio panel as
you think he may be able to, turning the lights off completely would only
cause the DRLs to come on then (which may work if setting the parking brake
turns off the DRL on this model) The Impala's DRLs are based on the
high-beam lamp, the light beam (albeit reduced intensity) would likely have
a even greater apparent brightness level than the regular headlamps due to
the fact that the DRL beam is shining upward into people's eyes if he can't
get them to go off. He's may be basically stuck! Wouldn't is just be
easier if the lights just worked like every other car company design out
there...the light switch that has a position that says all lights "OFF"?

Gm really needs to give the control of the basic functions of the car back
to the operator using simple _industry standard_ controls (for those that
want that control, at least). They are the only car manufacturer out there
that has so bastardized the lighting systems to the point that they don't
even work the same or look the same across their own product lines. The
parking brake will turn lights off on this model and not that one. Putting
the car in Park may do it on this one, but not that one. On the trucks and
large SUVs you can press the dome light button 4 times to turn them off. On
the Impala you do it through the radio panel (apparently). Good lord...put
the damn "lights off" function on the damn light switch where it belongs for
Pete sake! But, I know, I'm the oddball...the heck with having any sort of
normalcy or standard or intuitiveness to a control design. Let the driver
fumble with different standards while trying to operate the car, always a
good idea to do what ever you can to keep the driver as confused as
possible! (oops sorry, said I wouldn't rant, didn't I!) ;-)



"Roy G. Bragg" <***@flash.net> wrote in message news:z3oUa.15$***@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com...
| I don't know about base model Impalas, but my 2000 LS has the capability
to
| turn off the auto headlight feature through the radio panel. Personally,
I
| don't see the problem. If the headlights MUST be off with the engine
| running, turn on the park lights manually, that should turn the headlights
| off.
| Roy
| "James C. Reeves" <***@reevesweb.nospam.com> wrote in message
| news:***@comcast.com...
| > You're not doing anything wrong. Maddening as hell isn't it!? But you
| > won't get one bit of sympathy from the GM Lemmings that hang out in this
| > news group. They think the lighting idiocy GM forces on it's paying
| > customer is just as wonderful as apple pie (even if it is certainly NOT
as
| > "American" as apple pie!)! They'll say that you're some kind of nut
case
| > for wanting to turn you lights out when it's dark (even though there are
| > clearly some situations when you may want to...you example being one of
| > many). They don't think you have any right to have control over the
| > lighting systems (even though every state law I know of is very clear in
| > stating that it's the operator's responsibility...not the manufacturers,
| or
| > anyone else's). I've been down this road on this topic with GM...all
the
| > way up to letters to Bob Lutz. A few other people I know have also.
They
| > don't even write back...just a black hole. The dealer won't disable the
| > auto systems either! So, good luck. Next time buy a Ford or a Chrysler
| > product...they are normal cars that function like normal cars...
Imagine
| > that!? Now, here come the flames!!!
| >
| > "Burn Baby Burn" <***@home.com> wrote in message
| > news:***@4ax.com...
| > | Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
| > | was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
| > | leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
| > | During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
| > | DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
| > | the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
| > | parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
| > | on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?
| > |
| > | Thanks in advance,
| > | BB
| >
| >
|
|
Burn Baby Burn
2003-07-26 17:05:16 UTC
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Post by Roy G. Bragg
I don't know about base model Impalas, but my 2000 LS has the capability to
turn off the auto headlight feature through the radio panel. Personally, I
don't see the problem. If the headlights MUST be off with the engine
running, turn on the park lights manually, that should turn the headlights
off.
Roy
| Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
| was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
| leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
| During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
| DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
| the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
| parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
| on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?
|
| Thanks in advance,
| BB
The only thing I have programmable via the radio for lights is the
amount of time the headlights stay on when exiting the car after it is
turned off.

The headlight "switch" or decoration as I now call it, does NOTHING at
night.

The daytime running lights (DRL High beams at lower intensity) turn
off when the vehicle is shifted into park.

Anyways, MY solution after fiddling with it was fairly simple....
I went to radio shack and bought a tiny white LED lamp, a 680 ohm
resistor and some small gauge wire. Ran the wires from on top of the
dash to under the dash where they can't be seen, the LED sits on top
of the DRL sensor covered by a black rubber bicycle tire repair patch.
Hooked it all up to ignition switched power through a 1/4 amp fuse.

Now when the the car is turned on it enters DRL mode very quickly
regardless of the time of day or night. When in PARK at night, the
lights are off. Shift out of park, DRL's come on, then I can turn on
the headlights via the headlight switch, just like a real car!!!

If it were easy to access the wiring to the DRL sensor, which is
basically a light sensitive resistor, one could play with increasing
or decreasing the resistance to simulate DRL mode all the time, with
the headlight switch as an override... they way GM SHOULD have
designed it.

BB
frank
2003-07-26 23:47:14 UTC
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Whats a drive in?

( Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it was
hot,)

I had a 2000 Impala and now have a 2003 Malibu and both vehicles have the
capability to change the lighting controls, alarm controls, oil change
intervals, and a bunch of other features that you can change right through
the radio.
James C. Reeves
2003-07-27 00:01:16 UTC
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"Burn Baby Burn" <***@home.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
| On Fri, 25 Jul 2003 19:18:08 -0400, "James C. Reeves"
| <***@reevesweb.nospam.com> wrote:
|
| >You're not doing anything wrong. Maddening as hell isn't it!? But you
| >won't get one bit of sympathy from the GM Lemmings that hang out in this
| >news group. They think the lighting idiocy GM forces on it's paying
| >customer is just as wonderful as apple pie (even if it is certainly NOT
as
| >"American" as apple pie!)! They'll say that you're some kind of nut case
| >for wanting to turn you lights out when it's dark (even though there are
| >clearly some situations when you may want to...you example being one of
| >many). They don't think you have any right to have control over the
| >lighting systems (even though every state law I know of is very clear in
| >stating that it's the operator's responsibility...not the manufacturers,
or
| >anyone else's). I've been down this road on this topic with GM...all the
| >way up to letters to Bob Lutz. A few other people I know have also.
They
| >don't even write back...just a black hole. The dealer won't disable the
| >auto systems either! So, good luck. Next time buy a Ford or a Chrysler
| >product...they are normal cars that function like normal cars... Imagine
| >that!? Now, here come the flames!!!
| >
| >"Burn Baby Burn" <***@home.com> wrote in message
| >news:***@4ax.com...
| >| Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
| >| was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
| >| leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
| >| During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
| >| DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
| >| the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
| >| parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
| >| on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?
| >|
| >| Thanks in advance,
| >| BB
|
| Yes, maddening as hell, but your rant wasn't helpful in the least.
|
| BB

You didn't like my suggestion to buy a different manufacturers car? That is
what I'm going to do! But hopefully it relayed that you aren't alone, at
least. :-) Your LED solution sounds like it worked out fairly well. Too
bad you had to go through the trouble to make the car work the way it should
in the 1st place.

One solution I've read some have done is to actually _replace_ the ambient
light sensor circuit with a fixed resistor at the proper resistance rating
that tells the BCM that it's daytime all the time. That way the headlights
never come on at all by sensor...basically making the lights function
manually at night (well except for the DRL portion). You might want to try
that one out sometime as well...once the warranty has expired, that is! :-)
Burn Baby Burn
2003-07-27 00:15:09 UTC
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On Sat, 26 Jul 2003 20:01:16 -0400, "James C. Reeves"
Post by James C. Reeves
You didn't like my suggestion to buy a different manufacturers car? That is
what I'm going to do! But hopefully it relayed that you aren't alone, at
least. :-) Your LED solution sounds like it worked out fairly well. Too
bad you had to go through the trouble to make the car work the way it should
in the 1st place.
One solution I've read some have done is to actually _replace_ the ambient
light sensor circuit with a fixed resistor at the proper resistance rating
that tells the BCM that it's daytime all the time. That way the headlights
never come on at all by sensor...basically making the lights function
manually at night (well except for the DRL portion). You might want to try
that one out sometime as well...once the warranty has expired, that is! :-)
Actually, at the bottom of my LED solution message, I mentioned that
if I had access to the wires to the DRL sensor without ripping half
the friggin car apart, I would have done that. Apparently to get to
the sensor, the front dash plate must be removed. That involves too
much disassembly of the all the trim starting at the middle of the car
and moving forward. LED works just fine! :-)

BB
Harry Face
2003-07-27 02:45:37 UTC
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BBB

Next time you go to the Drive In Movies and want to run the car with the
air on, drape two bath towels over the front of the car, preferably
black towels..

=========
Harryface
=========

1991 Pontiac Bonneville LE
~_~_~260,000 miles_~_~~_
Chris Moore
2003-07-27 15:56:25 UTC
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I have a 2003 Malibu with automatic headlights and DRL (Canadian spec -- ALL
cars are required to have Daytime Running Lights)

The following instructions are IN THE OWNERS MANUAL......

Daytime Running Lamps (DRL)

"The DRL system will remain off any time your vehicle
is in PARK (P) or the parking brake is engaged, and
the vehicle speed is less than 8 mph (13 km/h),
for United States vehicles only."

Automatic Headlamp System

"To idle your vehicle with the system off, set the park
brake while the ignition is off. Then start the vehicle.
The system will stay off until you release the park brake."

(if they don't work that way, maybe the system is actually mal-functioning
and needs repair...just a thought)

Might not be the same on the Impala, but it really IS amazing what you can
discover if you take the time to read (which most people don't.......)

"Burn Baby Burn" <***@home.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?

Thanks in advance,
BB
James C. Reeves
2003-07-28 21:54:43 UTC
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"Chris Moore" <***@reply.here> wrote in message news:dBSUa.152$***@news20.bellglobal.com...
| [SNIP]
|
| Might not be the same on the Impala, but it really IS
| amazing what you can discover if you take the time
| to read (which most people don't.......)

Kind of tough to read the manual when you're at a dark drive-in. :-) A
novel idea, actually, is to have the light switch actually operate the
lights...a industry standard approach to vehicle lighting control that
everyone already knows how to do. ;-) Wouldn't that make a heck of a lot
more sense?

| "To idle your vehicle with the system off, set the park
| brake while the ignition is off. Then start the vehicle.
| The system will stay off until you release the park brake."

I have a 03 Malibu LS, and mine does work the way described. But each GM
model seems to have a different quirk to understand relative to how the
lights work when you run into these unusual situations when one needs to
operating them outside the parameters GM thinks they should operate. No
telling if the Impala works the same way. Assuming for the sake of
discussion it does, the problem possibly is that he didn't wait for the
"delay off" to turn them off before he tried this procedure?
Roy G. Bragg
2003-07-30 05:08:16 UTC
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The Impala does work the same way as described in the Malibu. To defeat the
delayed turnoff, turn the manual light switch on and off after shutting off
ignition. Works on my Impala.
Roy
Post by James C. Reeves
| [SNIP]
|
| Might not be the same on the Impala, but it really IS
| amazing what you can discover if you take the time
| to read (which most people don't.......)
Kind of tough to read the manual when you're at a dark drive-in. :-) A
novel idea, actually, is to have the light switch actually operate the
lights...a industry standard approach to vehicle lighting control that
everyone already knows how to do. ;-) Wouldn't that make a heck of a lot
more sense?
| "To idle your vehicle with the system off, set the park
| brake while the ignition is off. Then start the vehicle.
| The system will stay off until you release the park brake."
I have a 03 Malibu LS, and mine does work the way described. But each GM
model seems to have a different quirk to understand relative to how the
lights work when you run into these unusual situations when one needs to
operating them outside the parameters GM thinks they should operate. No
telling if the Impala works the same way. Assuming for the sake of
discussion it does, the problem possibly is that he didn't wait for the
"delay off" to turn them off before he tried this procedure?
James C. Reeves
2003-07-30 19:29:01 UTC
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Interesting. I don't remember that in the Malibu manual, but may have
forgotten it.

I wonder why GM would default to the delay cycle since most of the time it
isn't really needed. (at least where I live there are more lights around at
night already, the delay headlights are of little use most of the time). On
my Chrysler products it's the opposite...they go off immediately when
switched off unless you evoke the delay manually...so you use the delay-off
feature only when the feature is actually needed (if ever).

"Roy G. Bragg" <***@flash.net> wrote in message news:4pIVa.7279$***@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...
| The Impala does work the same way as described in the Malibu. To defeat
the
| delayed turnoff, turn the manual light switch on and off after shutting
off
| ignition. Works on my Impala.
| Roy
M Hayes529
2003-07-28 22:40:18 UTC
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That is so stupid, you have to have a government letterhead to prove you can
alter the lights.. IF I paid for my car and I drive my car they can go kiss my
ass..... Its my car I can do with it what I want... My Roadmaster has twilight
sentinal, they used to work....... Now I just put the lights on when it gets
dark....

Bastards.... GM

Jake
James C. Reeves
2003-07-29 01:07:18 UTC
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"M Hayes529" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:***@mb-m12.aol.com...
| That is so stupid, you have to have a government letterhead to prove you
can
| alter the lights.. IF I paid for my car and I drive my car they can go
kiss my
| ass..... Its my car I can do with it what I want... My Roadmaster has
twilight
| sentinal, they used to work....... Now I just put the lights on when it
gets
| dark....
|
| Bastards.... GM
|
| Jake

Many feel that way...more than GM's management ego (and many of the GM
Lemmings in this forum) will admit. Hopefully GM will soon come back around
to doing the right thing by their customers. Perhaps the additional 1%
continued loss in market share over the last year will wake some people up
up there in the ivory towers!
M Hayes529
2003-07-29 01:23:27 UTC
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Stupid jerks.... When those flipping daytimes running lights are on, the
asshole cops can see you better far away to get a lock on your car with their
Radar guns that GM and the Insurance bastards donated to them...... I HATE
DRLS>>>>>>

Jake

My 95 Avalon has them but you can shut them off if you want........
James C. Reeves
2003-07-29 22:51:16 UTC
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"M Hayes529" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:***@mb-m05.aol.com...
|
| Stupid jerks....

No arguement from me on that one! ;-)

| When those flipping daytimes running
| lights are on, the asshole cops can see you better far
| away to get a lock on your car with their radar
| guns that GM and the Insurance bastards donated to
| them...... I HATE DRLS>>>>>>

I had also read articles from a few years ago that statistically cars with
DRLs are ticketed more frequently in radar stops compared to those without.
But I don't know if I actually believe that one or not. But, I suppose it's
possible.

|
| Jake
|
| My 95 Avalon has them but you can shut them off if
| you want........

As is the case with all of the other car manufacturers...the option
rightfully (and legally in the US) is that of the owners to make...NOT the
manufacturer to force on people.
David Spera
2003-07-29 11:04:21 UTC
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Post by James C. Reeves
Many feel that way...more than GM's management ego (and many of the GM
Lemmings in this forum) will admit. Hopefully GM will soon come back around
to doing the right thing by their customers. Perhaps the additional 1%
continued loss in market share over the last year will wake some people up
up there in the ivory towers!
Well they haven't noticed since the sixties when they had over 50% on the
market!

Daytime running lamps are NOT REQUIRED in the USA. Therefore there is not legal
reason they shouldn't be able to be turned off.
James C. Reeves
2003-07-29 22:41:45 UTC
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"David Spera" <***@stargate.net> wrote in message news:***@stargate.net...
|
| Well they haven't noticed since the sixties when they had
| over 50% on the market!

You may be right, unfortunatelly.

|
| Daytime running lamps are NOT REQUIRED in the USA. Therefore
| there is not legal reason they shouldn't be able to be turned off.
|

True, they are not required in the USA. In fact the NHTSA rule refers to
their use as "voluntary". Even more compelling is that the competitors to
GM that also offer DRLs, will either allow the ability for the owner to turn
them off on their own (VOLVO has a small screw hole under the light switch
for example that sets the mode) or will allow the dealer to turn them off by
request (BMW & Toyota will set the DRL mode the owner wants). Ask GM to
exercise your legal right...they don't even respond...completely ignore
emails and letters from paying customers. Sad situation indeed.
Steve Mackie
2003-07-31 03:23:51 UTC
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1. Turn off car.
2. Apply parking brake.
3. Start car.

Steve
Post by Burn Baby Burn
Ok, what am I doing wrong? Went to the drive-in the other night, it
was hot, had to leave the car running for air conditioning. Had to
leave very embarassed, could NOT turn off the headlights!!
During the day, when the DRL are on, shifting into park kills the
DRL's. But at night, when all the lamps are on, shifting into park
the headlights stay on if the car is running. I tried applying the
parking brake, turning the engine off and on, damm lights keep comming
on. Any suggestions other than take a hammer to the headlights?
Thanks in advance,
BB
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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James C. Reeves
2003-08-03 01:51:12 UTC
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"Steve Mackie" <***@ns.sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:bZ%Va.24888$***@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...
| 1. Turn off car.
| 2. Apply parking brake.
| 3. Start car.
|

Not quite. After your step 1 he will then either...

a) Have to wait for the delay off cycle to activate
for the lights to go out. OR...
b) Manually override the delay off by using the
switch...(manually/momentarily turn _on_
the park light and turn back off to
override the remaining time on the delay-off).

Then, and only then, will proceeding to your step 2 and 3 work.

Problem is NO ONE will figure that out without some reading of the manual.
Even if they had read the manual earlier, this procedure is not likely
remembered easily if not applied very often.

Easier solution? ...a OFF position on the light switch...which is the
definition of a "switch", after all...NO? Everyone keeps trying to justify
why a switch is not a switch and why someone should have to manipulate all
of these unrelated items in the car in a confusing multi-step process is
just making the design GM has implemented all the sillier. Thanks for the
help!! ;-) I'm surprised we don't have to recite a incantation while doing
all this stuff!
Steve Mackie
2003-08-03 03:28:08 UTC
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Hrm, interesting.

1. Are Canadian and US Impala's the same?
2. Was there a change in the Impala regarding lighting from 2000 to 2001?

The only recent GM cars I have experience with are my parents 2000 Impala
and 2002 Intrigue (oh, and my 1995 Monte Carlo, but it's too old to have all
those fancy features). I don't recall the headlight delay feature being on
the Impala, but I do know it's on the Intrigue. Unless the headlight delay
was disabled via the radio controls. Can you do that? I also remember when
applying the parking brake, regardless if the car was running or not, the
DRLs would turn off. I would also like to say the headlights turned off when
the "Sentenal Lighting", or whatever they call them, is active, but I can't
remember.

Some insight from people on the two questions would be nice though. ;)

Steve
1995 Chevrolet Monte Carlo Z34 (Canadian Edition) <- with broken DRL module
which is not going to be fixed. :)
Post by James C. Reeves
| 1. Turn off car.
| 2. Apply parking brake.
| 3. Start car.
|
Not quite. After your step 1 he will then either...
a) Have to wait for the delay off cycle to activate
for the lights to go out. OR...
b) Manually override the delay off by using the
switch...(manually/momentarily turn _on_
the park light and turn back off to
override the remaining time on the delay-off).
Then, and only then, will proceeding to your step 2 and 3 work.
Problem is NO ONE will figure that out without some reading of the manual.
Even if they had read the manual earlier, this procedure is not likely
remembered easily if not applied very often.
Easier solution? ...a OFF position on the light switch...which is the
definition of a "switch", after all...NO? Everyone keeps trying to justify
why a switch is not a switch and why someone should have to manipulate all
of these unrelated items in the car in a confusing multi-step process is
just making the design GM has implemented all the sillier. Thanks for the
help!! ;-) I'm surprised we don't have to recite a incantation while doing
all this stuff!
---
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Dave Brower
2003-08-03 05:19:09 UTC
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Post by James C. Reeves
...a OFF position on the light switch...which is the
definition of a "switch", after all...NO?
No.....some switches have an off position, some don't. Your dimmer switch is
an example of a switch without an off position.

Dave
Post by James C. Reeves
| 1. Turn off car.
| 2. Apply parking brake.
| 3. Start car.
|
Not quite. After your step 1 he will then either...
a) Have to wait for the delay off cycle to activate
for the lights to go out. OR...
b) Manually override the delay off by using the
switch...(manually/momentarily turn _on_
the park light and turn back off to
override the remaining time on the delay-off).
Then, and only then, will proceeding to your step 2 and 3 work.
Problem is NO ONE will figure that out without some reading of the manual.
Even if they had read the manual earlier, this procedure is not likely
remembered easily if not applied very often.
Easier solution? ...a OFF position on the light switch...which is the
definition of a "switch", after all...NO? Everyone keeps trying to justify
why a switch is not a switch and why someone should have to manipulate all
of these unrelated items in the car in a confusing multi-step process is
just making the design GM has implemented all the sillier. Thanks for the
help!! ;-) I'm surprised we don't have to recite a incantation while doing
all this stuff!
Rich B
2003-08-03 12:20:32 UTC
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On the 2002 Impala, the lights and locks are programable through the
radio. The headlights can be turned off while parked by setting the
parking brake.

******************************************
I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~
James C. Reeves
2003-08-03 14:04:06 UTC
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Nope, they only stay off if they are already off. Once they are on, they
don't go back off when setting the parking brake (The DRLs do though).
Another person posted part of the procedure...I added step 1b

1a. Turn the engine off
1b. Either wait for the delay off to turn the headlights off
OR manually override the delay by switching to parking
light and off again. (may be a radio control also)
2. Set the emergency brake
3. Restart the car.

A procedure that takes 30 seconds to 2 minutes..

Now for nearly every other non-GM car on the road.

1. Turn the light switch to off.

A procedure that takes 1-2 seconds. (and is a
universally known standard procedure)

The fact that so many people in this NG that are _knowledgeable_ about cars
can't agree how to turn the lights off on GM vehicles while running the
engine speaks volumes in and of itself to the idiocy of the control system
GM has implemented, don't you think?


"Rich B" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:19491-3F2CFE10-***@storefull-2155.public.lawson.webtv.net...
| On the 2002 Impala, the lights and locks are programable through the
| radio. The headlights can be turned off while parked by setting the
| parking brake.
|
| ******************************************
| I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
| liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
| ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
|
James C. Reeves
2003-08-03 20:22:33 UTC
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Think about it. How then would (or could) the headlight delay system work
then if the headlights actually turned off as you stated when setting the
parking brake? The intent of the headlight delay system is to park the car,
put in park, set the brake and turn off the engine and still have light from
the headlights long enough to find your way to your door before they go
off...all the newer GM's I've driven do this. Even my cheap Malibu does
this. Is it possible you've programmed your Impala so not to have the
headlight delay-off function (which may change the procedure to what you
described)?

In my owner manual it's clearly stated that the parking brake must be set
_before_ you start the car to run the engine without the lights (at night).
Once you've released the parking brake (or start the car with the parking
brake not set) the lights come on (by the ambient sensor) and they will not
go back off by resetting the brake. The DRLs will go back off during the
day, but the headlights won't at night.

Of course the caveat is that different models and different years sometimes
have different implementations as well which requires different procedures
(which adds to the potential confusion).


"Rich B" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:22326-3F2D50CA-***@storefull-2152.public.lawson.webtv.net...
| Gee! I guess that my lights on my 2002 Impala are defective because I
| can turn them off with the vehicle parked by using the parking brake
| (but Jim says that I must be imagining this).
|
| ******************************************
| I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
| liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
| ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
|
Me
2003-08-03 22:12:04 UTC
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I really wish they would just put on an extra setting, Off, Auto, Park, Head
would be nice. But I think the eventual goal is eleminating switches and
such. I have read reports about the miles of wire in cars etc and how every
little bit of weight must be reduced to continue increasing gas milage.
Thats why they are going to the serial bus between the radio and body and
engine computers. Rather than having three seperate boxes (radio, body
compueter, engine computer) as well as wiring between each and wiring two
and from light switches and lights going through the firewall. If they can
consolidate the body computer with the radio and eliminate the switches and
wires to and from them they can have just a pair of wires from the
radio/computer to the engine computer and have a short wire from the engine
computer to the lights eliminating light wiring through the firewall and to
the light switch. It fits in with all the technologies going into the smart
cars and such
Post by James C. Reeves
Think about it. How then would (or could) the headlight delay system work
then if the headlights actually turned off as you stated when setting the
parking brake? The intent of the headlight delay system is to park the car,
put in park, set the brake and turn off the engine and still have light from
the headlights long enough to find your way to your door before they go
off...all the newer GM's I've driven do this. Even my cheap Malibu does
this. Is it possible you've programmed your Impala so not to have the
headlight delay-off function (which may change the procedure to what you
described)?
In my owner manual it's clearly stated that the parking brake must be set
_before_ you start the car to run the engine without the lights (at night).
Once you've released the parking brake (or start the car with the parking
brake not set) the lights come on (by the ambient sensor) and they will not
go back off by resetting the brake. The DRLs will go back off during the
day, but the headlights won't at night.
Of course the caveat is that different models and different years sometimes
have different implementations as well which requires different procedures
(which adds to the potential confusion).
| Gee! I guess that my lights on my 2002 Impala are defective because I
| can turn them off with the vehicle parked by using the parking brake
| (but Jim says that I must be imagining this).
|
| ******************************************
| I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
| liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
| ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
|
James C. Reeves
2003-08-04 23:21:33 UTC
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"Me" <***@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message news:UMfXa.36807$***@fe3.columbus.rr.com...
| I really wish they would just put on an extra setting,
| Off, Auto, Park, Head would be nice.

That would satisfy customers on both sides...I agree that GM should do this.
Customers prefer choices in their products (a elementary concept that you
would think GM would have figured out decades ago!)

| But I think the eventual goal is eleminating
| switches and such. I have read reports about
| the miles of wire in cars etc and how every
| little bit of weight must be reduced to continue
| increasing gas milage.

Perhaps. But I would think that having all of these unrelated items
(parking brake, shift lever, radio,etc.) all tied into the control of the
lights (I assume each "thing" has some sort of switch and associated wires
in order to function) would be even more complex requireing even more wires
than having only one switch (the light switch) handling all the lighting
functions.

| Thats why they are going to the serial bus between the
| radio and body and engine computers. Rather than having
| three seperate boxes (radio, body compueter, engine
| computer) as well as wiring between each and wiring two
| and from light switches and lights going through the firewall.
| If they can consolidate the body computer with the radio
| and eliminate the switches and wires to and from them
| they can have just a pair of wires from the radio/computer
| to the engine computer and have a short wire from the
| engine computer to the lights eliminating light wiring
| through the firewall and to the light switch. It fits in
| with all the technologies going into the smart
| cars and such

Except you will still need the lighting control wiring to all of the other
devices that affect the status of the lights...wouldn't you? I think it's
more the fact that the customer will be locked into buying a $800 GM-built
radio when their original one quits working since a 3rd party audio system
won't work. That strategy will turn the customer off in the end and cost GM
big time. You can't purposefully screw the customer and expect them to
always like it. Again, the customer will prefer choices and options.
James C. Reeves
2003-08-05 22:18:04 UTC
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"David Spera" <***@stargate.net> wrote in message news:***@stargate.net...
|
|
| Me wrote:
|
| > I really wish they would just put on an extra setting, Off, Auto, Park,
Head
| > would be nice.
|
| Actually Ford and Chrysler have this with their automatic headlights.
| But they don't have the DRLs (unless you take that option). I think
| Fords and Chrysler go like this:
| Auto, Off, Park, On.
|
| Maybe Bob Lutz might bear some light on this for us.
|

I like the pun! :-) Obviously Ford and Chrysler listen to their customers
better than GM does. (I know one does...Chrysler often does customer focus
groups on items like this...or used to before Daimler).

I've already sent two letters to Bob Lutz (now at GM) on this item and he
has ignored both of them...no reply whatsoever. No thanks for the
suggestion..nothing! He sure has changed since leaving Chrysler...a true
"car guy" when he was there...wanting to know (and deliver) everything
possible that the customer wanted! Anyway, good luck. If by chance he
responds to you, I'd be curious to know what he says.
Steve W.
2003-08-05 23:23:29 UTC
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Must have been different Chrysler products than the ones I ran. 98 Caravan,
Auto every light on as soon as started up. 99 Caravan DRLs were standard
item, they even released little DRL labels because they used the marker
lights. 2000 Caravan, DRLs in the headlights,2001 the same.
--
Fort Plain NY
Post by James C. Reeves
|
|
|
| > I really wish they would just put on an extra setting, Off, Auto, Park,
Head
| > would be nice.
|
| Actually Ford and Chrysler have this with their automatic headlights.
| But they don't have the DRLs (unless you take that option). I think
| Auto, Off, Park, On.
|
| Maybe Bob Lutz might bear some light on this for us.
|
I like the pun! :-) Obviously Ford and Chrysler listen to their customers
better than GM does. (I know one does...Chrysler often does customer focus
groups on items like this...or used to before Daimler).
I've already sent two letters to Bob Lutz (now at GM) on this item and he
has ignored both of them...no reply whatsoever. No thanks for the
suggestion..nothing! He sure has changed since leaving Chrysler...a true
"car guy" when he was there...wanting to know (and deliver) everything
possible that the customer wanted! Anyway, good luck. If by chance he
responds to you, I'd be curious to know what he says.
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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Steve W.
2003-08-06 05:00:32 UTC
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Nope not required. However we run with Kalifornicators when it comes to
vehicle crap. I actually liked the 98s auto on lights ( no OFF control)
--
Fort Plain NY
I have a 03 Stratus and 97 Caravan. No DRLs. Daughter has a 2000 Neon,
no
DRLs either. Does New York require them? They're optional in Maryland
(on
the Chryslers and other non-GMs)
| Must have been different Chrysler products than the ones I ran. 98
Caravan,
| Auto every light on as soon as started up. 99 Caravan DRLs were standard
| item, they even released little DRL labels because they used the marker
| lights. 2000 Caravan, DRLs in the headlights,2001 the same.
|
| --
| Fort Plain NY
|
| >
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > | > I really wish they would just put on an extra setting, Off, Auto,
| Park,
| > Head
| > | > would be nice.
| > |
| > | Actually Ford and Chrysler have this with their automatic
headlights.
| > | But they don't have the DRLs (unless you take that option). I think
| > | Auto, Off, Park, On.
| > |
| > | Maybe Bob Lutz might bear some light on this for us.
| > |
| >
| > I like the pun! :-) Obviously Ford and Chrysler listen to their
| customers
| > better than GM does. (I know one does...Chrysler often does customer
focus
| > groups on items like this...or used to before Daimler).
| >
| > I've already sent two letters to Bob Lutz (now at GM) on this item and
he
| > has ignored both of them...no reply whatsoever. No thanks for the
| > suggestion..nothing! He sure has changed since leaving Chrysler...a
true
| > "car guy" when he was there...wanting to know (and deliver) everything
| > possible that the customer wanted! Anyway, good luck. If by chance
he
| > responds to you, I'd be curious to know what he says.
| >
| >
|
|
|
|
| -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
| http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
| -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
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-----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
James C. Reeves
2003-08-06 21:41:05 UTC
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Interesting. The different trends are curious as well. Chrysler had turn
signal DRLS earlier and have switched to headlight DRLs (if I read your
earlier post correctly) and GM seems to be going the opposite direction from
headlamp DRLs to turn signal DRLs. I wonder if there will ever be a
standard DRL config.

"Steve W." <***@home.org> wrote in message news:***@corp.newsgroups.com...
| Nope not required. However we run with Kalifornicators when it comes to
| vehicle crap. I actually liked the 98s auto on lights ( no OFF control)
|
| --
| Fort Plain NY
|
| "James C. Reeves" <***@reevesweb.nospam.com> wrote in message
| news:r3qdnYhk-92C-***@comcast.com...
| > I have a 03 Stratus and 97 Caravan. No DRLs. Daughter has a 2000 Neon,
| no
| > DRLs either. Does New York require them? They're optional in Maryland
| (on
| > the Chryslers and other non-GMs)
| >
| > "Steve W." <***@home.org> wrote in message
| > news:***@corp.newsgroups.com...
| > | Must have been different Chrysler products than the ones I ran. 98
| > Caravan,
| > | Auto every light on as soon as started up. 99 Caravan DRLs were
standard
| > | item, they even released little DRL labels because they used the
marker
| > | lights. 2000 Caravan, DRLs in the headlights,2001 the same.
| > |
| > | --
| > | Fort Plain NY
| > |
| > | "James C. Reeves" <***@reevesweb.nospam.com> wrote in message
| > | news:***@comcast.com...
| > | >
| > | > "David Spera" <***@stargate.net> wrote in message
| > | > news:***@stargate.net...
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | > | Me wrote:
| > | > |
| > | > | > I really wish they would just put on an extra setting, Off,
Auto,
| > | Park,
| > | > Head
| > | > | > would be nice.
| > | > |
| > | > | Actually Ford and Chrysler have this with their automatic
| headlights.
| > | > | But they don't have the DRLs (unless you take that option). I
think
| > | > | Fords and Chrysler go like this:
| > | > | Auto, Off, Park, On.
| > | > |
| > | > | Maybe Bob Lutz might bear some light on this for us.
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > I like the pun! :-) Obviously Ford and Chrysler listen to their
| > | customers
| > | > better than GM does. (I know one does...Chrysler often does customer
| > focus
| > | > groups on items like this...or used to before Daimler).
| > | >
| > | > I've already sent two letters to Bob Lutz (now at GM) on this item
and
| > he
| > | > has ignored both of them...no reply whatsoever. No thanks for the
| > | > suggestion..nothing! He sure has changed since leaving Chrysler...a
| > true
| > | > "car guy" when he was there...wanting to know (and deliver)
everything
| > | > possible that the customer wanted! Anyway, good luck. If by chance
| he
| > | > responds to you, I'd be curious to know what he says.
| > | >
| > | >
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > | -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
| > | http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
| > | -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
| >
| >
|
|
|
|
| -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
| http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
| -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
Rich B
2003-08-04 00:27:43 UTC
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Jim, I'll have to admit that I rarely use my park brake. Also, the
area around my home is well lighted and I carry "protection" with me in
case anyone gets any bright ideas (so I don't worry about the lights
staying on). They are programmed for delay function but I turn them off
with the Fob anyway..

******************************************
I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~
James C. Reeves
2003-08-05 22:32:31 UTC
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"Rich B" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:4095-3F2DA87F-***@storefull-2156.public.lawson.webtv.net...
| Jim, I'll have to admit that I rarely use my park brake. Also, the
| area around my home is well lighted and I carry "protection" with me in
| case anyone gets any bright ideas (so I don't worry about the lights
| staying on). They are programmed for delay function but I turn them off
| with the Fob anyway..
|
| ******************************************
| I would rather be exposed to the inconveninces attending too much
| liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
| ~ Thomas Jefferson ~
|

My neighborhood is well lighted too...so I also have little need for the
delay feature, actually.

I noticed your sig quote from Thomas Jefferson. I visited Monticello (near
Charlottesville, VA) and Independence/Congress Hall (and other sites) in
Philadelphia a couple of weeks back. What an amazing and versatile man for
his day. Monticello is a very interesting piece of architecture. I also
visited Montpelier as well while I was near Charlottesville (Home of James
Madison)
Nathan Ross
2016-07-28 18:18:00 UTC
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replying to Burn Baby Burn, Nathan Ross wrote:
I know you asked your question long ago. I just came into same problem. I have
an out headlight and every time they automatically came on I ran the risk of
being pulled over. Hear is the best fix I know of. Under the hood on passenger
side there should be to fuse boxes. Mine was in the top of the 2. There is a
fuse marked DRL(Daytime running lights) relay. I pulled mine which did take a
little bit of effort do to having larger fingers. After pulling the fuse I no
longer have automatic lights and they do still work perfectly off the switch
as they normally should. I hope this helps you..
--
posted from
http://www.motorsforum.com/gm/ecm-temp-sensor-2004-pontiac-grand-prix-78057-.htm
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